Couple of possible bugs

[garson]

Hi nuhi

I am trying to remove couple of things from Windows 10 ISO (1909 and LTSC 2021), and they seem to be removed (I see size of removed files, and in log as well) but on next load of already slimmed image, they show up again, and when I check them for removal, I don't see file size (it just says Done). So I guess they were removed on first run, but N|TLite recognizes them again.
Thore are text services framework, HTML Viewer (and 32bit version). See atached images.

Also, I am contantly getting 2 Privacy settings to be configured (attached image settings.jpg).

Maybe not a bug, but I removed "OLE for process control (OPC) library" and it broke start menu left click (with error message Critical error etc.) and Settings as well.

 

[Txmmy]

run this clean up preset and should be fixed i would suggest to not remove this "OLE for process control (OPC) library"

 

[garson]

If you refer to this
<CleanHotfixedLeftovers>3</CleanHotfixedLeftovers>
I am running this all the time, didn't help.

 

[crypticus]

let nuhi investigate this problem, just wait

 

[garlin]

VHD isn't used in normal desktop settings, but many virtual machine products (Hyper-V, VMware, VirtualBox) expect it.
Make a note for users who don't read the preset.

 

[Txmmy]

hey garlin been a while, if you are talking about my preset its only an update cleanup, its helped me in the past getting rid of items being ghosted
and technically not on the sytem but still showing up in registry and component backup or where ever nt lite looks for whats installed on the system, i find this really helps with a live install when the start menu shows those items that are unclickable and just clutter up the menu area
running this and they disappear, ive experimented even with running this on a image right from microsoft, its funny that it cuts 1GB from a iso
downloaded right from microsoft without doing anything, and ps nuhi damn scheduled tasks added my man, thats a damn nice feature

 

[crypticus]

hey garlin been a while, if you are talking about my preset its only an update cleanup, its helped me in the past getting rid of items being ghosted
and technically not on the sytem but still showing up in registry and component backup or where ever nt lite looks for whats installed on the system, i find this really helps with a live install when the start menu shows those items that are unclickable and just clutter up the menu area
running this and they disappear, ive experimented even with running this on a image right from microsoft, its funny that it cuts 1GB from a iso
downloaded right from microsoft without doing anything, and ps nuhi damn scheduled tasks added my man, thats a damn nice feature

the preset you are talking about is actually killing all the future windows update support. when you clean update backup, you are creating possible conflicts with future updates. and they highly fail. you are not just doing a cleanup. ofc you get lots of free space because you remove nearly every dependency for future updates.

also there is "host refresh" feature to remove leftovers. your method is not related. just a side effect.

 

[Txmmy]

Never would have figured that clicking an NTlite update option to be completely mess up updating, if that is so (it hasn't broke any future updates for me ive been using it from the beginning and literally never had an issue checking and then installing updates after using this preset)

it clearly states that this is a feature to clean update backup, remove obsolete updated backup files, keeping only the latest versions.
all existing service packs and updates cannot be uninstalled after this operation. this will not block the uninstallation of future service
packs or updates

maybe you should get nuhi to add your description of what that custom update feature does and how it works, I would assume that its
literally removing the old junk files not needed now with the updated iso and the ones actually still required for update # whatever
being left behind by the old version and scrubbing what is no longer required, like when you update windows 10 iso from 21H1 19043.928
to 21H2 19044.134, got to clean out all that junk that's been added to the iso during the update process, never broke anything
cleaning the iso or the live install dumping all those sweet gb's well doing it, so I'm very comfortable using this and suggesting
it to try and aid others

if this is your response "the preset you are talking about is actually killing all the future windows update support"
I would actually look at other things you are doing to the iso, as this has never broken anything and I've probably
done it 1337 times and have never experienced any negative effect, all I've ever watched it do is drop the iso
back down to OEM size after modifying stuff or updating

 

[crypticus]

Its not a subject i'm going to argue with you, its a fact. I don't remove risky things, over years i gained enough experience to not to break things and catch the sweet spot for me. Update cleanup is a possibility, a risk that doesn't worth to take for me. Storage is not an issue, and its not giving you any performance boosts.

NTLite Documentation

Detailed description of main NTLite features

www.ntlite.com

Clean update backup
An option in the toolbar, used to remove the obsolete files, replaced by their updated versions.
It can be useful to significantly reduce the size of the updated target, to fit an image to the FAT32 4GB limit or to simply reduce the size of the installation. It removes the ability to uninstall current updates.
There are 3 modes of operation:
– DISM (Compatible) – in this mode it is using the Windows built-in function to clean updates. While it is the maximum compatible method, in terms of it having the least chances of breaking a future package installation, it can be quite slow and picky on its environment. If it denies to work in your particular target, try the Custom mode (not as compatible with future updates). DISM modes do not support Windows 7.
– DISM (ResetBase) – same as above, plus removes a bit more, with a higher risk of breaking updatability and Windows Reset of Win10 1903 and newer.
– Custom (Complete) – uses the custom engine for cleaning the old versions, while retaining the update compatibility in almost all of the cases. Report any issues and update with Host Refresh tool if stuck.

 

[garlin]

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/wi...op/clean-up-the-winsxs-folder?view=windows-11

Use the /StartComponentCleanup parameter​

• Using the /StartComponentCleanup parameter of Dism.exe on a running version of Windows 10 or later gives you similar results to running the StartComponentCleanup task in Task Scheduler, except previous versions of updated components will be immediately deleted (without a 30 day grace period) and you will not have a 1-hour timeout limitation.
  From an elevated command prompt, run:
• Dism.exe /online /Cleanup-Image /StartComponentCleanup

Use the /ResetBase switch with the /StartComponentCleanup parameter​

• Using the /ResetBase parameter together with the /StartComponentCleanup parameter of DISM.exe on a running version of Windows 10 or later removes all superseded versions of every component in the component store.
  From an elevated command prompt, run:
• Dism.exe /online /Cleanup-Image /StartComponentCleanup /ResetBase
  
  Warning
  All existing service packs and updates cannot be uninstalled after this command is completed. This will not block the uninstallation of future service packs or updates.

Use the /SPSuperseded parameter​

• To reduce the amount of space used by a Service Pack, use the /SPSuperseded parameter of Dism.exe on a running version of Windows to remove any backup components needed for uninstallation of the service pack. A service pack is a collection of cumulative updates for a particular release of Windows.
  From an elevated command prompt, run:
• Dism.exe /online /Cleanup-Image /SPSuperseded
  Warning
  The service pack cannot be uninstalled after this command is completed.

 

[Txmmy]

argue who's arguing, if you are reading between the lines on me just talking and being straight forward when talking then that's on you mate, not me I'm just talking I wish i could be someone else and talk like them but alas I cant be someone else so, imagine a world where you can write only 240 chars and that's all you have to work with, I wonder how much toxicity would just be assumed into being reality, literally stated my understanding of the function and the man thinks I'm arguing about something, I'm sitting here wondering what is there to argue about, I can debate you all day if you like

thanks garlin, its hard just being some computer hobbyist mashing buttons over here, trying to play some games and experiment with the windows os, its kinda crazy how much hate i get just from chatting away innocently being me, just saying whats on my mind and the person on the other end of the line just getting all triggered and such

 

[garlin]

Let's get back to education here. Suppose you have someone's preset, and don't know which WinSxS cleanup they've chosen.

DISM Compatible:

<CleanHotfixedLeftovers>1</CleanHotfixedLeftovers>

DISM ResetBase:

<CleanHotfixedLeftovers>4</CleanHotfixedLeftovers>

Custom:

<CleanHotfixedLeftovers>3</CleanHotfixedLeftovers>

 

[Txmmy]

nice, i would have to ask what is the difference as the descriptions all kind of seem to mean basically the same thing just in different way, i was interested in the dism ones as they are something that I have dealt with before i recognize dism from creating custom iso image from a live install, and i understand or is thinking that it has to do with the servicing stack? is there a better option then this custom one, i found this thing within someone elses preset on github and thought what it did to an iso downloaded right from microsoft, i was impressed and intrigued when this is the only thing i chose to do and it reduced the iso size without ever touching or editing anything

 

[garlin]

DISM Compatible is removing all backups except the original backup.
DISM ResetBase is removing all backups.

What does that mean? On a live system, we keep updating the system over time especially with monthly CU's. Stacking up layers.
DISM Compatible removes most of the obsoleted files, but allows us to still rollback any updates. DISM ResetBase "flattens out" the image until it can't be rolled back.

For a new image, normally we don't stack updates on top of each other. We don't apply June, July, Aug & Sept. Just skip to Sept.
Because we keep one backup, the difference btw DISM Compatible and ResetBase won't be as dramatic. Still ResetBase wins on space savings.

Flattening images is lowered risk, if you mess up then create a new image. Flattening a system in Host Refresh is riskier, there is no rollback possible. Your options afterwards are to reimage, or hope for a future update.

I don't know what's in Custom cleanup. Colonel's 11 secret herbs & spices??

 

[AeonX]

Eventually Clean update backup (Custom) breaks the installation of cumulative updates but nuhi has improved this over time and I haven't seen a fix for this in the changelog for some time.

DISM Compatible is what Microsoft uses in their ISO's so this is totally safe as long as you don't use preview updates. And it is not as slow in 1903 and later as it is in 1809 and earlier as it no longer needs to delta compress the backup of superseded files for the entire cumulative update package.

DISM ResetBase breaks Reset this PC feature in 1809 and earlier and breaks installation of cumulative updates from 1903 onwards.

Custom is similar to DISM Compatible but much faster.

But my preferred mode is the one used in W10UI by abbodi1406 which restores the delta compress of dism /startcomponentcleanup (DISM Compatible) which was disabled in offline image in 1903 and later. This generates slightly smaller ISO's.

 

[crypticus]

argue who's arguing, if you are reading between the lines on me just talking and being straight forward when talking then that's on you mate, not me I'm just talking I wish i could be someone else and talk like them but alas I cant be someone else so, imagine a world where you can write only 240 chars and that's all you have to work with, I wonder how much toxicity would just be assumed into being reality, literally stated my understanding of the function and the man thinks I'm arguing about something, I'm sitting here wondering what is there to argue about, I can debate you all day if you like

thanks garlin, its hard just being some computer hobbyist mashing buttons over here, trying to play some games and experiment with the windows os, its kinda crazy how much hate i get just from chatting away innocently being me, just saying whats on my mind and the person on the other end of the line just getting all triggered and such

what are you even talking about? calm down argue/talk/discuss same thing for me. no one fights in this forum we are learning/helping only.