In Settings is there a way to show/enumerate what 'Default' is actually set to?

S

stevecs

New Member
Going through several iterations and builds here and am thinking about running some tests (from the GamerOS thread, if I can actually find the time) but noticed that in the Configure/Settings options it does not list what 'Default' is. (unlike say in Services/Features it shows manual/automatic/whatever). But the Configure/Settings just shows 'default' which is not really that helpful unless you have some divine insight as to what 'Default' is for that particular image.

Was kind of hoping that there may be some method or way to have ntlite enumerate what the 'default' actually *IS* to make it much easier to compare builds/settings.
 
without sounding too blunt, but what are you on about ?

Default is the standard behaviour for the said option. whatever that option you are querying is..... your post is far too vague and unclear.


The GamerOS preset is a GUIDELINE that can be changed to your specific needs. NOTHING is the final answer until you decide on it yourself
 
Sorry if it was not clear. I am looking for the actual 'current' value/setting not the vague term 'default'. For example

Configure/Settings/Desktop/Search (Taskbar) : Default

However the actual settings that it can be are: Disabled, Icon, Search Box.
I have no reference point as to what 'Default' is pointing to. Is the default 'Icon' or 'Search box' or 'Disabled'? Same with pretty much all items in the Settings section.

Basically, is there enough information to pull from the image to populate not just 'Default' which I am assuming means that NTLite has not changed the setting. But what the ACTUAL setting is/would be for that image? Something like:


Configure/Settings/Desktop/Search (Taskbar) : Default (Search box)

Does that make more sense?
 
default is as out of the box. the default setting is what you get on normal install. the options are for how you want it to be displayed. It is set as default because it is there for the user to customise as want. IF you want a default search, leave as default. want the icon ? click it to icon. they are just customisations which come with windows as is.
 
most apps/icons/settings on a fresh install are set as default. so when you install windows from vanilla, the default is for some dektop items to be hidden/not visible.

that is a more clearer answer. They are just for how you want to have things.
 
I understand that. The issue is that when trying to customize images I may not KNOW what the 'default' is for that particular image. I.e. It changes over time and whenever microsoft decides to change the 'default'. They don't notify me when they are making their changes like the rest of the world.

So, I understand what you're saying is that whatever that settings is has not been modified by NTlite. However what I am asking is, is there a way to pull *WHAT* that setting (whatever it may be) and display that to the user. So yes, it's 'default' but under say windows server 2016 that particular item is an icon. Under windows desktop that is a search box. I am just trying to get that information as, frankly, I don't have the ability to memorize what the 'default' is for every version/build.
 
NTLite is agnostic, it doesn't know what the defaults are for any of those settings. It's whatever is presented in the image. If you know it's a clean source, then out of the box NTLite displays what they are. The color coding reflects the possible real-life settings.

So no, NTLite cannot provide you a list of default values from one image, and compare them to another. There is no master database of values. All NTLite understands is for a given setting, what are the documented possible values for it so it can provide the right drop-down choices.
 
If you do make personal edits, hitting Reset will revert all settings to their loaded defaults. Which may not reflect the factory values.
 
right, so the actual setting is not something that is easily pulled from the image? I am not familiar with the process of the installers, reason why I'm asking. But I would have thought that this would be possible as it's the kind of the inverse of setting/changing the value.

is there not a centralized registry on the image that can be read and pull / interpolate the settings? i.e. if (in the example above) if the setting is a '1' or '0' or whatever since ntlite knows what to change it to (i.e. push) to that value then it should have the lookup table already as to match what is currently there would it not?
 
Yes. But that's not NTLite's job. You would have to account for all the different releases and editions. Home is different from Pro, different from Education, different from Enterprise. Not to count W10 1809, 19H1, 19H2, 20H1, 20H2, 21H2, 22H2.... W10 RTM is still supported.

You can pull the image's system hives and Default user's NTUSER.DAT to load if you want. If you use a debloat/tuning script off the web, it's even worse -- it's always a one-way street and they don't bother documenting the defaults other.
 
So perhaps you can clarify just for my understanding. Does NTLITE then just not really check the settings on the image and just push out the registry/group policy settings to be applied when the image is installed?

Hmm. I just did a simple test here, built an image and changed a couple settings. Then used the 'new' image as the base and it apparently does show that some of them are set so it does appear to read the image? It does appear to loose track of what a 'default' is (i.e. you can't unset) but it does read.

So are the values for the settings not even present on a 'fresh' image and only after they are set will they show up or something? Just trying to understand.
 
stevecs said:
So perhaps you can clarify just for my understanding. Does NTLITE then just not really check the settings on the image and just push out the registry/group policy settings to be applied when the image is installed?
Click to expand...
What you are asking for, needs lots of time but time is needed for fixing bugs that you can see are reported here in the forum, but many bugs are reported by mail, troubleshooting needs time (edit, build, install, test, verify) to find a fix. All that job is done by only one nice guy, moderation team are volunteers and not part of the NTLite build/programming process.

As you can read, there are too many builds that needs time to test, cumulative and other updates are released every month, all that even more time to test.
 
stevecs said:
So perhaps you can clarify just for my understanding. Does NTLITE then just not really check the settings on the image and just push out the registry/group policy settings to be applied when the image is installed?

Hmm. I just did a simple test here, built an image and changed a couple settings. Then used the 'new' image as the base and it apparently does show that some of them are set so it does appear to read the image? It does appear to loose track of what a 'default' is (i.e. you can't unset) but it does read.

So are the values for the settings not even present on a 'fresh' image and only after they are set will they show up or something? Just trying to understand.
Click to expand...
Short of trying to explain how NTLite is architected, do this instead:

1. Open CMD, and run "NTLite.exe /saveallstates"
2. Load a clean image, save a preset immediately.
3. Load another clean image, save another preset.
4. Repeat until bored.
5. Quit from NTLite. You've captured the existing Settings values as present in the images.
6. Compare any two presets with a text comparison tool. Filter on the <Settings></Settings> block.
 
stevecs said:
Hmm. I just did a simple test here, built an image and changed a couple settings. Then used the 'new' image as the base and it apparently does show that some of them are set so it does appear to read the image? It does appear to loose track of what a 'default' is (i.e. you can't unset) but it does read.
Click to expand...
I know exactly what you are talking about in this thread since I was looking for this answer at one time too. I will try to both answer what you are asking, and also show steps to replicate so others can see your question in action:

In NTLite, if you load an image and go to the "Settings" menu on the left, and then under the "Explorer" options look for "Cache thumbnails", it usually is shown as "Default" for the value in NTLite. What stevecs is asking, is if he integrates a "Disabled" value into his image, will his modified image now have a value of "Disabled" when he loads it in NTLite. The answer is yes. NTLite does recognize that there is something different here than the normal default.

If you want to see this in real-time, load a *live* unmodified image into NTLite, go to this tweak and it will say "Default". Now change it to "Disabled" and process the image, and you will have 3 keys for "NoThumbnailCache" added to your registry. Load your live image again and in NTLite the value will now be "Disabled". To reset this, unload the image, manually delete the 3 keys from Regedit, load the live image again and now it's back to "Default".

This is probably because NTLite is coded to specifically check the presence of the registry keys that it installs with each tweak, rather than being coded to know what an unmodified Microsoft ISO's true defaults are.
 
Last edited:
garlin said:
Short of trying to explain how NTLite is architected, do this instead:

1. Open CMD, and run "NTLite.exe /saveallstates"
2. Load a clean image, save a preset immediately.
3. Load another clean image, save another preset.
4. Repeat until bored.
5. Quit from NTLite. You've captured the existing Settings values as present in the images.
6. Compare any two presets with a text comparison tool. Filter on the <Settings></Settings> block.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this, as it really helps. Is there a way to request that this setting be included in the settings.xml or a checkbox in the gui opposed/in addition to a command flag? I see myself using this as my 'default' for now on as it provides much better detail than just a delta.
 
No, /forcelistcomponents & /saveallstates are restricted to the command-line. They are advanced modes which will break your images if you use NTLite for anything other than dumping presets from images. I forgot it was enabled, and a processed image never finished installing.
 
garlin said:
No, /forcelistcomponents & /saveallstates are restricted to the command-line. They are advanced modes which will break your images if you use NTLite for anything other than dumping presets from images. I forgot it was enabled, and a processed image never finished installing.
Click to expand...
Really? So you can't dump load an oem image with /saveallstates modify and then apply that to the same image? What scenarios did you try that in that it failed? I just tried it a couple times here on a Win2022 server image without an issue. (note, this is NOT using /forcelistcomponents which I can see that having issues) or if you tried to apply the settings to a different base oem image which would have different defaults.

UPDATE: ok, ran several more tests here with different selections (settings/features) and also further modifying the saved preset a second time (against a fresh image). and yes, I *DO* see issues as you mentioned, so I guess it depends on what selections you have enabled/used.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top